[butch_mr2]

What's the best brake fluid for our cars? Should I replace it with Dot4? Or, stick with Dot3. What's the best brand for our cars? Or, get one from Toyota Dealer.

 

[qmtran]

Daily driven or track car?

 

[cosmin]

I've been using ATE Super Blue. Holds up at the track well.

 

[dev]

I would stick with Toyota DOT 3 fluid. Some of the racing fluid or the like doesn't hold up as well for the street and needs to be flushed regularly.

DOT 4 is more viscus and not recommended. Unless you are experiencing fluid fade there is no logical reason to buy expensive fluid.

 

[cosmin]

I would stick with Toyota DOT 3 fluid. Some of the racing fluid or the like doesn't hold up as well for the street and needs to be flushed regularly.

DOT 4 is more viscus and not recommended. Unless you are experiencing fluid fade there is no logical reason to buy expensive fluid.

You have a reference for that?

DOT 3 and 4 are both hygroscopic. DOT 4 has a higher boiling point (wet or dry). Race cars change oil more often too. That doesn't mean that the oil they use is inferior for street driving.

I don't think price is a big difference, compared to what you pay for pads and rotors. Question is, why would anyone buy DOT 3 brake fluid haha.

 

[T-bone]

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[cosmin]

because it absorbs less water than DOT4, it is less expensive than DOT4, for street use it is perfectly safe and will last longer as it absorbs less water.

DOT 4 will out perform DOT 3 when new and will, at worst, perform the same as DOT 3 as it absorbs water. You should be replacing your brake fluid every couple of years anyway.

$7 for 12oz of Toyota DOT 3. Or $17 for 1 L of ATE Super Blue. Price is the same.

 

[T-bone]

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[cosmin]

Dunno. I don't use my brakes.

If you're going to replace the fluid regularly why not do it with a high performance fluid? I used almost a full 1 L bottle of ATE last time I flushed my fluid. I'm guessing you'll need at least 2 of those Toyota bottles to do the job. Price is not an issue, stop bullshitting.

 

[T-bone]

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[dev]

You have a reference for that?

DOT 3 and 4 are both hygroscopic. DOT 4 has a higher boiling point (wet or dry). Race cars change oil more often too. That doesn't mean that the oil they use is inferior for street driving.

I don't think price is a big difference, compared to what you pay for pads and rotors. Question is, why would anyone buy DOT 3 brake fluid haha.

Yes I do however it is in the search where I went into detail with links. I would like to look it up however I have been very busy lately to do the research again but it's out there.

I have personally experienced higher end brake fluid losing it's effectiveness for the long term in both my clutch and brakes. I wondered why and came a across an interesting tidbit which stated that although DOT 4 brake fluid is less hygroscopic the fact of the matter is it doesn't take much water to have an exponential effect on the brake fall off which can be dramatic.

DOT 3 on the other hand is more hygroscopic however it has the ability to hold more water and have a gradual effect on the braking system over time due to the effects of fluid fade.

After this information it became apparent that racing fluid is meant for racing and although it can take high boiling points both wet and dry it cannot stand up to long term use in a daily driver and must be changed out more often.

Now someone on the last discussion/ debate pointed to BMW's using DOT 4 fluid and after researching it I found that it is a low viscus DOT 4 similar to DOT 3 formulated for street use however it must also be changed in two years mandatory as part of the service interval. So this may be the exception but then again it's not racing fluid.

The bottom line for any of these brake discussion is get what you need not what you think you need.

 

[butch_mr2]

The car is sort of for daily driving. I was thinking of getting a good brand of off the shelf from autozone or pepboys. Has anyone use a different brand of brake fluid? Or, should I stick with toyota brand?

 

[dev]

The car is sort of for daily driving. I was thinking of getting a good brand of off the shelf from autozone or pepboys. Has anyone use a different brand of brake fluid? Or, should I stick with toyota brand?

You cant go wrong with any good DOT3 fluid however I would stick with Toyota brand only because it's quality fluid and designed with the right formulation for the seals and everything else.

 

[pelinors714]

The car is sort of for daily driving. I was thinking of getting a good brand of off the shelf from autozone or pepboys. Has anyone use a different brand of brake fluid? Or, should I stick with toyota brand?

just use something from autozone.. im using valvoline dot3&4 "synthetic" so far so good. im on stock brake lines and random ceramic pads.... soon to be upgrading my pads and lines to ss lines though. but imma still just stick with cheap fluid for daily driving

 

[dev]

Race cars change oil more often too. That doesn't mean that the oil they use is inferior for street driving.

I missed this one. Oil that is used for racing (depending on the kind of racing) is formulated very differently then street oil. They trade short term extreme durability for longevity in their formulations. I have experienced this first hand with "racing transmission fluid" where it did not last longer then a few months before my transmission became loud and the synchros were not engaging properly.

Most of the so called performance oils like Redline and the such are really street oils with formulation that lasts so that it's a non issue.

The best way to summize this discussion is that racing fluids is like lighting a candle from both ends.

 

[qmtran]

DOT 3 and DOT 4 have almost the same formulation except DOT 4 has some extra checmicals to raise the boiling point. DOT 3 is being replaced by DOT 4 fluids. Luxury cars are making the switch so the common man's car would soon follow trend. Cost is the same so either way you go, you should be ok.

You should be flushing your fluids every few years anyways...

A number of import car makers do recommend brake fluid changes for preventive maintenance at specific time/mileage intervals:
Acura: 36 months
Audi: 24 months
BMW: 24 months, or when indicated by Service Inspection Indicator
Honda: 36 months
Jaguar: 24 months all models except 2009 XF (36 months)
Land Rover: 36 months
Lexus: 36 months or 30,000 miles, which ever comes first
Mercedes-Benz: 24 months
MINI 24 months
Saab: 48 months (all models except 9-7X)
Smart: 24 months or 20,000 miles, which ever comes first
Subaru: 30 months or 30,000 miles (normal service) or 15 months/15,000 miles (severe service)
Suzuki: 24 months or 30,000 miles, which ever comes first (Forenza & Reno), 60 months or 60,000 miles (Grand Vitara and SX4)
Volkswagen: 24 months (New Beetle, City Gold, City Jetta), 36 months (all other models except Routan)
Volvo: 24 months or 37,000 miles (Normal), or 12 months (severe service)

 

[Ken Branch]

For daily driving just go with TOYOTA dot 3, added stainless steel brake lines this winter and flushed system with fresh fluid. Can't go wrong with stock fluid.

 

[NitroMidgets]

If you are concerned about the water content of the fluid they make dip strips for testing your fluid. I just use the regular DOT3 fluid.

 

[rcntype]

After using ATE superblue on my DD, I now have to agree with Dev's point on it not being a good substitute for a street car that does most of its driving on public roads. I did track the car once or twice and autox's but mainly it was my dd. With only a few months use, I noticed my pedal was getting really spongy. Went to go bleed and all I got was air bubbles. I have never seen so much air in brake fluid with such a short period of time used. I also used two different methods to bleed and both got the same result, mucho air in the system.

To back up the ATE fluid at the same time they do recommend bleeding the brakes before and after every track event.

I will be going back to regular brake fluid for the streets, mainly cause I'm too lazy to be bleeding brakes every month.

 

[dev]

DOT 3 and DOT 4 have almost the same formulation except DOT 4 has some extra checmicals to raise the boiling point. DOT 3 is being replaced by DOT 4 fluids. Luxury cars are making the switch so the common man's car would soon follow trend. Cost is the same so either way you go, you should be ok.

You should be flushing your fluids every few years anyways...

A number of import car makers do recommend brake fluid changes for preventive maintenance at specific time/mileage intervals:
Acura: 36 months
Audi: 24 months
BMW: 24 months, or when indicated by Service Inspection Indicator
Honda: 36 months
Jaguar: 24 months all models except 2009 XF (36 months)
Land Rover: 36 months
Lexus: 36 months or 30,000 miles, which ever comes first
Mercedes-Benz: 24 months
MINI 24 months
Saab: 48 months (all models except 9-7X)
Smart: 24 months or 20,000 miles, which ever comes first
Subaru: 30 months or 30,000 miles (normal service) or 15 months/15,000 miles (severe service)
Suzuki: 24 months or 30,000 miles, which ever comes first (Forenza & Reno), 60 months or 60,000 miles (Grand Vitara and SX4)
Volkswagen: 24 months (New Beetle, City Gold, City Jetta), 36 months (all other models except Routan)
Volvo: 24 months or 37,000 miles (Normal), or 12 months (severe service)

Well that's a different kind of DOT 4 fluid. It's what they call a low viscosity DOT 4 . The aftermarket DOT 4 is viscus and can cause problems in the cold and some say a problem with the rubber seals.
Even though these newer luxury cars recommend DOT 4 they also need you to come in religiously for a fluid flush because the fluid cannot hold as much water and can cause a safety issue.