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Discussion Starter #1
Hey gang,
Afetr 2 years of looking, I've finally located an '04 Spyder with a Honda K20A2, and it's been turbocharged. It's a California car and body appears to be in good shape. I have no hands on experience with Honda engines, so I'm particularly looking for advice there. There's 80k on motor, 180k on car (kind of high).

Is 17k a fair price?

What questions should I ask the Seller? Greatly appreciate comments, suggestions, and advice, thanks.

Here's what I know about the car:
Honda K20A2 (from Acura Type S)
  • arp head studs
  • cosmic head gasket
  • blueprint dual valve springs
Turbo kit
  • Full race v1 manifold
  • Garrett gt3076
  • Air to water intercooler setup
  • Kpro v4 ECU
  • Boost Gauge
Transmission
  • gear x 1-4 (note: what does this mean?)
  • competition twin disk clutch
  • 06 si lsd
  • Shifter, Mr2 spider, with innovative conversion
  • Trans is a k20a2 6spd trans with twin disc clutch.
Fuel setup
  • 10 feed 8 return running (not sure what this means)
  • (2) aem inline 350 LPH (not sure what this means)
  • Victory motor sport 2000cc injectors
Suspension
  • Front is tien super low drop springs
  • Rear is 7k coilover with spring
Brakes
- slotted rotors, otherwise stock
Dyno'd at 501 HP (this must be at the flywheel or could it be WHP?)
 

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1) if it is worth it???---- yes every penny, but I would NOT buy it. Why sell if put so much effort to build it. When getting car like this it's best to build yourself

2) you could find rolling chassis and for around that much $ pretty much recreat the car but will know 100% that it's good, quality build.

3) wtf why vary coilovers and tien??? Feels like drag car (considering no way to pass california smog with that setup=not street legal)

4) 500hp on almost stock k20 sounds like asking for trouble + I if you don't have experience with modded spyders, do not go 500hp. Because of light weight of spyder that 500 hp is like driving a TAIL HAPPY 1000 hp Supra.---- you will not push limit of performance other than straight line
 

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  • 10 feed 8 return running (not sure what this means)
  • (2) aem inline 350 LPH (not sure what this means)
10 AN feed line and 8 AN return line

I think what he’s trying to say is that those pumps are external pumps and he’s got two in-line after the tank.

Probably whp

ask him more about the fuel system.Does it still have the in tank pump? Was that 500 on e85? Are the lines e85 compatible? Flexfuel? What ems does it have? Does he have the coolant gauge on the dash working? Who did the wiring and how was it done? Ask to see it. It would suck to buy it only to find out it’s a hack job.

still have ac?

it has head studs and the valve train was replaced. Asked who did the work and if it wasn’t him, If they have the paperwork for the work that was done. Was it rebuilt?

then the obvious why is he selling if there was so much work put into the car? Etc etc
 

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Discussion Starter #4
1) if it is worth it???---- yes every penny, but I would NOT buy it. Why sell if put so much effort to build it. When getting car like this it's best to build yourself

2) you could find rolling chassis and for around that much $ pretty much recreat the car but will know 100% that it's good, quality build.

3) wtf why vary coilovers and tien??? Feels like drag car (considering no way to pass california smog with that setup=not street legal)

4) 500hp on almost stock k20 sounds like asking for trouble + I if you don't have experience with modded spyders, do not go 500hp. Because of light weight of spyder that 500 hp is like driving a TAIL HAPPY 1000 hp Supra.---- you will not push limit of performance other than straight line
In my state, neither emissions nor safety inspection is required, so one less headache there.
Not sure why suspension was changed the way it was. Sounds like it will be very stiff, correct?
I have a stock Spyder, but have experience racing so I'm not too worried about car getting away from me, will just take it easy at first.
Thanks
 

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If you are looking for a daily driver you will find the suspension very stiff and there will be a lot of noise and vibration from the engine because he probably is using a full set of urethane motor mounts. The K20 is a very good engine that offers great performance in stock form and is strong enough to take a fair amount of boost. Note that 500 HP is more than twice what you get from the factory (205 - 220). If you are not experienced driving a mid engine car with a Weight/power ratio of better that 5 lbs / HP, be careful! You will want to be sure the OBD2 port is working and if it is, hook up a code reader to read any codes before you buy.

Dave
 

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Discussion Starter #6
10 AN feed line and 8 AN return line

I think what he’s trying to say is that those pumps are external pumps and he’s got two in-line after the tank.

Probably whp

ask him more about the fuel system.Does it still have the in tank pump? Was that 500 on e85? Are the lines e85 compatible? Flexfuel? What ems does it have? Does he have the coolant gauge on the dash working? Who did the wiring and how was it done? Ask to see it. It would suck to buy it only to find out it’s a hack job.

still have ac?

it has head studs and the valve train was replaced. Asked who did the work and if it wasn’t him, If they have the paperwork for the work that was done. Was it rebuilt?

then the obvious why is he selling if there was so much work put into the car? Etc etc
Good questions, I'll find out about things you mentioned, Thanks
 

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This car is pushing > 200hp/liter. I daily drove a car like that for a few years. It was built to very high standards by a very reputable shop. I limped home quite a few times. I got towed a few times, my daughter and I walked home one time, etc. Do not depend on such a car for reliability. Budget money for maintenance up to and including a full new engine or transmission. If you do not do your own work it will be expensive. On the plus side my daughter knows all about cranking the heat in the middle of summer to limp home from a softball game because Dad's crap car is in the process of blowing a head gasket!
 

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Cheap car, this guy is losing a lot on his build.
 

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One of the biggest issues with the K Series is its drivetrain. The "Gear X 1-4" is dog transmission gears sold by Gear X here: Aftermarket Auto Parts and Accessories | GEAR-X. I have heard ok reviews about them.

For the fuel setup, this build is running AN10 lines for the fuel feed, AN8 lines for the return and is running 2 AEM fuel pumps. He is just running a bigger line to feed fuel into the fuel rail and smaller line to return fuel back into the fuel pressure regulator and fuel tank. I think he maybe running 2 AEM in-tank fuel pumps if he is running 2x AEM 340 LPH fuel pumps. I think the smallest liters per hour inline fuel pump that AEM makes is 400LPH.

Seeing how great K series engines are, I could see this making 501hp at the wheels. Especially on e85.

I would ask if the 501hp was made on e85? Is it only tuned for e85 or does it have a flex fuel sensor to run both gas/e85? Have the axles been upgraded to handle that power? Did a shop do any of the work or did he do all of the work himself?

Not too sure what a good price for this setup would be. But just off off the turbo, manifold, and the gear set, it seems like this guy is probably losing some money on this build.

Also, this car is probably a BEAST to drive. I would not feel safe (or be able to restrain myself from doing something stupid) driving a car like this on the street.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
1) if it is worth it???---- yes every penny, but I would NOT buy it. Why sell if put so much effort to build it. When getting car like this it's best to build yourself

2) you could find rolling chassis and for around that much $ pretty much recreat the car but will know 100% that it's good, quality build.

3) wtf why vary coilovers and tien??? Feels like drag car (considering no way to pass california smog with that setup=not street legal)

4) 500hp on almost stock k20 sounds like asking for trouble + I if you don't have experience with modded spyders, do not go 500hp. Because of light weight of spyder that 500 hp is like driving a TAIL HAPPY 1000 hp Supra.---- you will not push limit of performance other than straight line
I've got lots of hours behind a 911 Turbo, so I'm not too worried about being able to drive it.
Appreciate your insights on suspension, will look into further, thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
One of the biggest issues with the K Series is its drivetrain. The "Gear X 1-4" is dog transmission gears sold by Gear X here: Aftermarket Auto Parts and Accessories | GEAR-X. I have heard ok reviews about them.

For the fuel setup, this build is running AN10 lines for the fuel feed, AN8 lines for the return and is running 2 AEM fuel pumps. He is just running a bigger line to feed fuel into the fuel rail and smaller line to return fuel back into the fuel pressure regulator and fuel tank. I think he maybe running 2 AEM in-tank fuel pumps if he is running 2x AEM 340 LPH fuel pumps. I think the smallest liters per hour inline fuel pump that AEM makes is 400LPH.

Seeing how great K series engines are, I could see this making 501hp at the wheels. Especially on e85.

I would ask if the 501hp was made on e85? Is it only tuned for e85 or does it have a flex fuel sensor to run both gas/e85? Have the axles been upgraded to handle that power? Did a shop do any of the work or did he do all of the work himself?

Not too sure what a good price for this setup would be. But just off off the turbo, manifold, and the gear set, it seems like this guy is probably losing some money on this build.

Also, this car is probably a BEAST to drive. I would not feel safe (or be able to restrain myself from doing something stupid) driving a car like this on the street.
Appreciate the information, quite helpful. Yes, dyno run was on E85 at 18 lbs of boost. Car was professionally tuned, E85 only.
I don't believe axles have been upgradede. How big a problem is this?

Thanks for your insights.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
If you are looking for a daily driver you will find the suspension very stiff and there will be a lot of noise and vibration from the engine because he probably is using a full set of urethane motor mounts. The K20 is a very good engine that offers great performance in stock form and is strong enough to take a fair amount of boost. Note that 500 HP is more than twice what you get from the factory (205 - 220). If you are not experienced driving a mid engine car with a Weight/power ratio of better that 5 lbs / HP, be careful! You will want to be sure the OBD2 port is working and if it is, hook up a code reader to read any codes before you buy.

Dave
Regarding codes, should I be looking for anthing in particular? I'm experienced driving a 911 turbo. The Spyder might be rougher around the edges, but I'll take it easy at first. Good point though.
 

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Does the "Kpro V4 ECU" even support OBDII diagnostics?
Does the car have roll bar?
Have the brakes been upgraded?
This sounds more like a dragster than something you'd want to drive on the streets.
 

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This has almost double the HP to weight ratio of a 911 Turbo. I don’t think the people telling you to be careful are trying to be condescending. I think we all just say these things because we can all use the reminders.
 

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Guys. He’s driven one widowmaker, what’s wrong with another one...?... lol

I say buy it
 

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Mismatched suspension components....

...means he probably committed other sins he isn't telling about.

I don't trust it.
 

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Imho, the dog box basically limits the car to track use. I have one car with a dog box, it can be driven on the street but it is les than no fun. Dog boxes work best when you are fully committed, shifting in anger. This seems like a nice track car that needs finishing or a street car that needs taming. In either case it needs more work. For a street car it needs de-tuning and a different gearset. For a track car it needs a cage and safety equipment. In either case it needs brakes and suspension work commensurate with the intended use and performance capabilities.

It sounds like a fantastic project but not particularly usable as is. I suspect that is why it is for sale. It is purely a toy that requires more capital investment and a fair amount of time. It won't be used all that often. If you want such a toy and have the means then you could do a whole lot worse. If I were 10 years younger I'd seriously think about this as a basis for a pure track car. I personally don't see any use case for this car as a street car.
 

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Regarding codes, should I be looking for anthing in particular? I'm experienced driving a 911 turbo. The Spyder might be rougher around the edges, but I'll take it easy at first. Good point though.
You should be looking for any codes! Also look for any unset monitors if you are going to have to pass your state inspection. I can't think of any codes that you wouldn't want to fix. the number and type of codes will tell us how thorough a job he has done with the engine setup.

Dave
 
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