[Cap Weir]

THE P/S Pump gets a Power Up Sig from the Spyder ECU.. if the replacement ECU does not pull the line high or low, the P/S ECU will just start when it's powered up..

The P/S ECU will turn off the P/S Pump, if the P/S ECU is powered up, and Speed Sigs are present.. ( Coasting and restarting. )

The ONLY sigs that come from the Spyder ECU to drive the Cluster, is the Tack sig , Check Engine Lite.. the Temp Gauge, and the Oil Pressure lite.. The Temp sig comes through the CAN bus line.. I THINK the oil lite also comes from that also.. the tack and engine lite are 'Normal' wire functions

The A/C 'Controls' also talk through the CAN Bus from the Cluster to the ECU.. if you want to have A/C, you will need to hook up relays to do that function.. not hard.. The A/C also has a 'Freeze protection' temp sensor to turn off the compressor if the Evap gats too cold... that is also done through the CAN Bus.. you can replace that function by adding a Pressure Switch in the Accumulator/Dryer to detect low pressure ( Freezing.. open the switch ) to protect the Compressor from liquid Slugging..

Cap

 

[KseriesPower]

THE P/S Pump gets a Power Up Sig from the Spyder ECU.. if the replacement ECU does not pull the line high or low, the P/S ECU will just start when it's powered up..

The P/S ECU will turn off the P/S Pump, if the P/S ECU is powered up, and Speed Sigs are present.. ( Coasting and restarting. )


Cap

So basically what you're saying is just feed the P/S ECU a speed signal and it will work just fine (as in it will cut off the pump when you get up to speed and cut back on under a certain speed)?

 

[Cap Weir]

The PS ECU gets is Speed Sig from the Cluster.. when the Celica ECU is installed for the 2ZZ Swap, the Celica ECU knows nothing of the electric PS System, and ignores it.. When a 2ZZ swapped Spyder is started, the PS ECU will start the PS Motor right when the key is turned on, rather than waiting for a 'Running' sig from Spyder ECU..

The PS Motor is never turned off in normal activity.. its speed is varied to give different feel of the wheel.. as a 'Safety Feature', the PS ECU does a system check before turning on the PS Pump.. if when the PS ECU wakes up, it sees a Speed Sig, it will keep the PS Motor from running, and toss a PS lite, as it should never 'Come Alive' when the car is moving..

Yes the PS System will take care of itself.. you do not have to do anything with it.. just let the ignition switch turn on the Car Systems, and the ABS/PS and cluster will talk to each other no mater what ( If any ) ECU is in the Car..

The only thing you have to be conserned with is the Fuel Pump, Coil power and the Injector power.. you will loose the temp gauge, AC, Oil Lite and the Check Engine lit if the ECU is not a 'Spyder Friendly'.. ( Honda )..

ALL of the Immobilizer Transmitter/reader is in the Ignition Switch, and the Receiver is in the Spyder ECU, so that will not hamper you at all.. as no other 'Boxes' are involved in the Immob Function.

Cap

 

[rcntype]

I vote Cap to make wiring harnesses for us. :lol:

 

[silversprint]

The original K20 spyder had the Spyder ECU still in the car and ran with a Kpro. Not all the gauges in the cluster were working including the temperature gauge. No A/C.

 

[Ikrana]

The original K20 spyder had the Spyder ECU still in the car and ran with a Kpro. Not all the gauges in the cluster were working including the temperature gauge. No A/C.

In my k-swap i use the oem ecu for the body and kpro for the engine, i have connected everything so everything in the oem cluster works,
only problem i have is that the P/S is always on and as Cap said it starts when the key is turned, but if i understand it right, if i connect the the P/S ecu speed signal to the cluster speed signal it should work as oem?

 

[Thejfactor]

Would be great if boosted / ddpr got into this. They Def have the knowledge and now with more parts readily available they could be the ones to work out the final little details and then we would all be sweet.

 

[KseriesPower]

In my k-swap i use the oem ecu for the body and kpro for the engine, i have connected everything so everything in the oem cluster works,
only problem i have is that the P/S is always on and as Cap said it starts when the key is turned, but if i understand it right, if i connect the the P/S ecu speed signal to the cluster speed signal it should work as oem?

Seems like we are getting a conflict of information here.

The vehicle speed sensor goes through the combination meter (cluster) and it is converted to a squarewave signal which then goes to your P/S pump to control its speed based on RPM (pump is always on). From what Im gathering, If the speedometer works, your P/S pump should work like OEM(If the wires from your speedo to your P/s pump are still intact)

 

[DDPR]

Would be great if boosted / ddpr got into this. They Def have the knowledge and now with more parts readily available they could be the ones to work out the final little details and then we would all be sweet.

Sure - we can build whatever y'all need. We have a couple Ks lying around and we can put one in my spyder easily enough, although we have been planning on starting in on a 2GR swap kit next month - I will need a tranny though if you all need mounts as well.

What would you guys like us to make? Headers and exhaust? Swap Harness? Mounts and axles? Hoses? Shift linkage? Turbo Kit? All of the above?

Which K would you guys want to run?

Which EMS would you want to use? We can put some pretty great prices together on Pro EFI as we are at their deepest discount level. Or we can use a Hondata product if you prefer.

 

[rcntype]

Sure - we can build whatever y'all need. We have a couple Ks lying around and we can put one in my spyder easily enough, although we have been planning on starting in on a 2GR swap kit next month - I will need a tranny though if you all need mounts as well.

What would you guys like us to make? Headers and exhaust? Swap Harness? Mounts and axles? Hoses? Shift linkage? Turbo Kit? All of the above?

Which K would you guys want to run?

Which EMS would you want to use? We can put some pretty great prices together on Pro EFI as we are at their deepest discount level. Or we can use a Hondata product if you prefer.

V6 swap is awesome but how many people are really gonna do that swap with all the hammering involved? :lol: Providing parts for the K seems no brainer to me vs v6.

Most of the hardstuffs are already available or will be available soon from Innovative (unless you can make those parts for cheaper). Only thing holding people back is the electricals, a swap harness of some kind if thats even possible would be awesome. Header and exhaust would be second on the list I think.

Hondata would probably be the most likely EMS used, great support and widely used while being very user friendly.

 

[KseriesPower]

Sure - we can build whatever y'all need. We have a couple Ks lying around and we can put one in my spyder easily enough, although we have been planning on starting in on a 2GR swap kit next month - I will need a tranny though if you all need mounts as well.

What would you guys like us to make? Headers and exhaust? Swap Harness? Mounts and axles? Hoses? Shift linkage? Turbo Kit? All of the above?

Which K would you guys want to run?

Which EMS would you want to use? We can put some pretty great prices together on Pro EFI as we are at their deepest discount level. Or we can use a Hondata product if you prefer.

As far as K series go, Hondata Kpro is more than sufficient for 95% of builds.Innovative has mounts, linkage and supposedly coming out with axles.

Hoses and a swap harness would be nice.
A nice header with at least a 2.5" collector and a 3" exhaust would be ideal for most. I am in the market for a large tube header, and a 3" exhaust with a cutout that doesnt go below the rear cross member.
the best bang for buck motor is the k24a2 IMO

 

[Thejfactor]

I'd like to see the k24 swap instead of the v6 kit. As great as the v6 sounds is probably too much work for backyard swaps if you have to start doing fitment mods.

To make it easier I think we need to get a few constants worked out for the swap. Such as engine (though mostly likely everyone wants a tax k24a2), gearbox, engine wiring harness and ecu. The below is from kpro

Engine Swaps - Must use 02-04 Engine harness and 02-04 Transmission
Price Description
$695 Retail price (ECU must be sent to Hondata or authorized installer).
$1295 K-Pro with new Honda PRB ECU based off US RSX-

The is a new k tuner tuning tool Coming out soon which will ve cheaper than kpro and be compatible with the tsx harness and tsx ecu which would make things much cheaper and easier to source.

I know you could use a variety of engines, box's and ecus but if we work on 1 particular set up then at least we have a known solution fully worked out.

 

[Cap Weir]

Seems like we are getting a conflict of information here.

The vehicle speed sensor goes through the combination meter (cluster) and it is converted to a squarewave signal which then goes to your P/S pump to control its speed based on RPM (pump is always on). From what Im gathering, If the speedometer works, your P/S pump should work like OEM(If the wires from your speedo to your P/s pump are still intact)

Not a conflict..

He wants the PS Pump to wait untill the Engine is running before it actually turns the pump on.. Like it does in the Spyder with a 1ZZ ECU in it.. Presently his PS pump starts when his Key is turned to the ON Position, just as a Swapped Spyder Does..That is just a function of figuring out exactally how the Spyder ECU 'Lets' the PS ECU run the PS Motor.. My SPECULATION is it could be acomplished by an Oil Pressure switch pulling the PS ECU Line to either Ground or +12 when the Engine gets oil pressure..

My SPECULATION is it's just a simple binary line to 'Release' the PS ECU after the Car Starts.. HOWEVER I have put NO Time in on this other that finding the wires involved in the comunication To From the two ECU involved, and putting them on the Excel Sheet..

Cap

 

[MikeV]

Not a conflict..

He wants the PS Pump to wait untill the Engine is running before it actually turns the pump on.. Like it does in the Spyder with a 1ZZ ECU in it.. Presently his PS pump starts when his Key is turned to the ON Position, just as a Swapped Spyder Does..That is just a function of figuring out exactally how the Spyder ECU 'Lets' the PS ECU run the PS Motor.. My SPECULATION is it could be acomplished by an Oil Pressure switch pulling the PS ECU Line to either Ground or +12 when the Engine gets oil pressure..

My SPECULATION is it's just a simple binary line to 'Release' the PS ECU after the Car Starts.. HOWEVER I have put NO Time in on this other that finding the wires involved in the comunication To From the two ECU involved, and putting them on the Excel Sheet..

Cap

Cap - if the PSCT pin runs the same way it does on earlier MR2s (and I'm 99.5% sure it does), your speculation is correct. When I set up a stand-alone EMS for a MKII, I pull the PSCT pin to ground above ~500 RPM to do the same thing. Never though of using a hobbs switch, but I see absolutely no reason it wouldn't work - other than my general reluctance to plumb things in the pressurized oil line to accomplish very simple things.

 

[Cap Weir]

I was thinking more along the lines of using the existing oil pressure Switch logic that is fed to the ECU ( Honda or Aftermarket ) then in a 'Conversion Box' ( Like will be needed for the A/C Function ) do what ever logic switching to get the Pull Hi or Pull Low Output Logic needed for the 'PS Activation Hold Off till Start Function'..

Adding a separate switch would be a little messy..

Cap

 

[MikeV]

BTW - regarding A/C, there are known A/C compressor clutch issues in many of the K24-equipped engines. Honda/Acura have voluntarily extended the warranty on those parts (not in a swap, I'm afraid). No idea how to tell a good one from a suspect one, though.

 

[MikeV]

Only somewhat readable A/C control circuit from a Honda (in this case I think it's a 2007-08 CRV, but others should be similar).

 

[Uvamosk]

Uva... This may be helpful to find alot of the answers you are looking for. As a matter of fact, they may all be hidden in this manual.

http://www.mr2.com/forums/mk-3-mr2-spyder/Toyota-MR2-61651-mk3-full-toyota-maintenance-manual.html

The speed sensor for ABS detects the wheel speed and sends the appropriate signals to the ABS ECU.
The ABS ECU converts these signals into a 4–pulse signal and outputs it to the combination meter.
After this signal is converted into a more precise rectangular waveform by the waveform shaping circuit inside
the combination meter, it is then transmitted to the vane pump assembly with motor. The vane pump
assembly with motor determines the vehicle speed based on the frequency of these pulse signals.

I have the printed manuals and the honda fsm also. Yep abs derives the speed signal.

Can anyone tell me what exactly the TRA wire that comes out of the abs computer does.

 

[Uvamosk]

BTW - regarding A/C, there are known A/C compressor clutch issues in many of the K24-equipped engines. Honda/Acura have voluntarily extended the warranty on those parts (not in a swap, I'm afraid). No idea how to tell a good one from a suspect one, though.

The swap would use the 1zz compressor. Innovative is working on a a/c braket for the lotus.
I am working on A/C right now. Worked out a large amount of the wiring today.
Also Kpro has configurable outputs getting PS to work like factory isnt to hard at all.

I have got the A/C figured out in a crude way and can make it work. I would like to make it a little easier though.

The only real hard stuff is figuring out how to work with this multiplex crap.

I do not plan to run the 1zz ECU at all. As far as I can tell at this moment its achievable.

 

[Uvamosk]

Cap I cant pm you.. I wanted to talk to you about your ideas for A/C mine involved wiring directly off the Hvac plug amd using relays. The way I would set it up would to memic the OBD2a Honda system.
This would cut out multiplex from the equation.

Alsobdo you know anything about the multiplex system. Im trying to find a pin out of the connector and a diagram of the system.