[dev]

I did my first set of lights using flap wheels and a bench grinder. My first setup prove inadequate, it vibrated apart. I disassembled my china freight special and reassembled it using quality lock washers and loctite. I would say I used my truck as a guinea pig, but I believe in the ethical treatment of animals.
Lets just say... the truck as OEM lights but all the mounting tabs are broken. For some reason folks throw away their old Tacoma lights all the time and replace them with amaebayzon crap. My lights were completely yellow and hazed over. I used a salvaged clay bar on them to removed the yellow. Turns out my favorite toothpaste is 3M ultra machine polish.


I'm very close to doing the spyder..., thanks for the tip!

Don't take this the wrong way as Im only giving you constrictive criticism. You can do better with a rotary polisher and actual polish. Your result is adequate but you can do better with having optical clarity on the lens.
Although toothpaste can get you somewhat there it is not designed for automotive use. Get a polisher with a pad.

 

[Chrioboy2]

Hey Dev. Sorry for the bad iphone4s photo yesterday. Let me clarify what my current setup consists of. I'm using a harbor freight 8" buffing/grinding bench, I couldn't find a convenient spot to put this in my garage so I decided to mount it upside down to a shelf bolted through a masonry wall. I'm using this model: https://www.harborfreight.com/8-inch-bench-grinder-buffer-94327.html
The only draw back was the direction of rotation, so its currently mounted backwards and is operated on a foot switch. This allows me to quickly maneuver large pieces underneath it. This headlight took me about 4 minutes once it was off the vehicle. I learned pretty quickly, after my first light, that tooth paste wasn't the best thing to have flinging around in the garage among many other things.... Just like my pre-cats reinstall, sometimes I just like to experiment.
After a quick clay bar, I used some "Novus #2" plastic scratch remover and a loose flannel flap wheel.
Then I used this polish: https://www.amazon.com/06068-Perfect-Ultrafine-Machine-Polish/dp/B0015PMQDI
3M ultra machine polish for acrylic finishes with a loose fine canton wheel backed with a sewn canton pad. Here is a supplier of flaps: https://www.caswellplating.com/buffs/wheels.html, I use McMaster-Carr.
Unfortunately, as I suggested earlier, these lights are well toasted. I used a tripod and a 18-55mm lens for this photo, I also made a legend for the creed of plastic we are dealing with here.
I have the hex pads you suggest and will invest a the hand rotary buffer very soon.

 

[dev]

That looks much better.

That bench buffer seems to work because it's actually cutting and burnishing unlike orbitals or cordless drills that don't have enough rpms.

However its hard to saturate with water. The way machine polishes work is a controlled uniform disintegration of the particles at the right time. Its very scientific and the best polishes have better consistency of the size of the particles as it breaks down.

So in a nut shell when you work in polishes you need to keep adding water as the polish has more working time as it breaks down. This will get all of microscopic sanding marks and make the plastic look like glass.

The better polishes has more predictable work time in the last stage before you stop so you know not to go too far. The mistake people often make is keep adding fresh polish however you might have to depending on needing more time if the bigger scratches did not have enough working time.

 

[Chrioboy2]

I used to drive around with my brights on all the time just to get an ounce of visibility. I got some friends coming over with similar shit lights, soon they and other motorists will be safer. I'll try to get before and afters with the tripod.
Thanks for thoroughly describing the difference between good and bad polish, I noticed my more abrasive cutting polish dries out a lot faster. Even Novus #3 dries out twice as fast as #2. The 3M product stays moist and sticks to material like a greased banmeplease.

 

[dev]

I used to drive around with my brights on all the time just to get an ounce of visibility. I got some friends coming over with similar shit lights, soon they and other motorists will be safer. I'll try to get before and afters with the tripod.
Thanks for thoroughly describing the difference between good and bad polish, I noticed my more abrasive cutting polish dries out a lot faster. Even Novus #3 dries out twice as fast as #2. The 3M product stays moist and sticks to material like a greased banmeplease.

Its a great gift to others and it costs you nothing. I actually enjoy clearing up the lenses just to see how much improvement I can achieve.
I could get them clear in just minutes but I take a little more time to get them to look like glass. The people I have done this for cant believe how much better they look.

 

[Uncle Mush]

Thanks for posting Dev. Much apprecited. I just recently purchased Griot's variable speed random orbital (instead of their BOSS system). I totally understand the need for the full-on polisher as opposed to the random orbital. My plan is to soon (maybe this weekend) purchase the Harbor Freight polisher and foam pad and then try one side of my Prius lights with the Griots and the other side with the Harbor Freight polisher -- just to see how significant the difference is. I am pretty sure I will not be satisfied with the Griots for the lights, but what the heck. Since I will have both machines, why not give it a try just for laughs and giggles.

I've done a fair amount of plastics buffing (not automotive parts) using a cloth wheel and compound and already know the importance of friction/heat for getting the plastics to shine like glass. I've gotten great results really quick but the temperature of the pieces I was buffing out became too hot to handle with bare hands -- not that I would want to take the heat to that extreme with the car's headlight lenses.

I'll try to remember to take before and after pictures of the lenses and results from the two different machines to post here (and then probably redo the random orbital side with the polisher). :biggrin-new:

 

[dev]

Thanks for posting Dev. Much apprecited. I just recently purchased Griot's variable speed random orbital (instead of their BOSS system). I totally understand the need for the full-on polisher as opposed to the random orbital. My plan is to soon (maybe this weekend) purchase the Harbor Freight polisher and foam pad and then try one side of my Prius lights with the Griots and the other side with the Harbor Freight polisher -- just to see how significant the difference is. I am pretty sure I will not be satisfied with the Griots for the lights, but what the heck. Since I will have both machines, why not give it a try just for laughs and giggles.

I've done a fair amount of plastics buffing (not automotive parts) using a cloth wheel and compound and already know the importance of friction/heat for getting the plastics to shine like glass. I've gotten great results really quick but the temperature of the pieces I was buffing out became too hot to handle with bare hands -- not that I would want to take the heat to that extreme with the car's headlight lenses.

I'll try to remember to take before and after pictures of the lenses and results from the two different machines to post here (and then probably redo the random orbital side with the polisher). :biggrin-new:

It will be interesting to see it in action UM.

You cant go wrong with the Griots stuff and I do believe their orbital polisher is a rebranded Porter-cable which I have.
Actually im planning to sell it because I thought I would use it based on those that use both a combination of Rotary and DA but what I found is the cheap Harborfright rotary polisher with the specialized pads does everything I need and it does it quick and effortlessly.
The DA takes more time than Im willing to spend and it doesn't burnish paint. Its pretty much useless to me except maybe to spread wax around but I no longer use wax. DA has its merits and it will do some correction but thats about it.

For those people that want to try machine polishing I tell them to stick to a DA because rotary is much harder to get right unless you understand the technique. Most people like myself in the beginning picked up the rotary and just went though the motions of being carful and the result was good. It was after years of understanding how its done from lots of trial and error it finally clicked.

It is an intense understanding of the polish characteristics and the pad characteristics that makes the difference. If you want to see a completely blemish free surface that looks like a mirror you need to take the rotary polisher to the limit and thats when you are in the zone that only lasts for a few minutes of working time. Burnishing paint is one part skill and one part science. I never knew how intense the professional detail world is but there are several levels of understanding and most that are paid to use a rotary polisher still don't use it to its maximum potential.

As for the clear plastic lens the reason why I recommend the rotary is simply because its much safer for a novice and very forgiving because its not a painted surface. Very hard to goof this up and it works like magic. To get them to look like glass its requires that last step of adding water to the already worked in polish keeping it lubricated so the polish gets finer and finer until the lens looks like a jewel.

Good luck in your adventure.

 

[dev]

If anyone is interested in using a rotary polisher on paint you can with a forgiving pad and polish. You will get a result as good or better than an DA in a short amount of time as long as you go slow and are aware that the edges are where you will burn paint. Some use blue painters tape on the edges.

If you want to really learn the skill to see what a rotary can do, buy a car door or hood from a junk yard. Use the polisher and make intentional mistakes.
See what it takes to burn or damage paint. Take the polisher to the edge and see what it is to get in that zone where you are burnishing paint.
Once you can see it and gain confidence without risking it on your car or someone elses it will click and you can do just about any car with professional results.

I have to admit that I burned paint on a car which required a touch up. It was not fun but part of the learning process of knowing how to be carful.

 

[MiMR2]

Most people I've heard that polish their lights mention the haze and yellowing comes back within weeks to months although I'm not sure if they used the buffing tool your are using. Are you not including a uv inhibitor after the polishing?

The headlights originally have a clearcoat that provides that UV protection. The clear breaks down, flakes off and the headlight yellows. You wet sand/compound/polish the damage away, and then the most robust method is to re-apply the clear. Infiniti G35 headlights share a lot of failure modes with the MR2s (yellowing, internal cracking) and correcting them and applying a 2k clear off amazon seemed to do the trick.

 

[edspecR]

Not sure why there're so many different threads and posts on forums/social media/youtube about this. Polishing is literally the act of finely sanding oxidation (the stuff that makes your headlights yellow) off. So many different products, so many different (errant) methods, but props to you OP for getting fed up with all the BS out there. As a guy in the industry, this is how you restore headlights. polish. duh.

first polish, then clear bra. and you won't have to worry about it hazing again for another 10 years (or whatever the warranty is on the specific PPF you use). period. you'll be re-applying UV inhibitors over and over again, so just get it done correctly the first time. clear coats fade (thats why you're doing this in the first place), dull and are prone to a whole host of other spraying-related issues.

toothpaste? sure, use it. headlight restoration kit? sure, go ahead. wet-sanding? your choice. but all you're really doing is polishing anyway, so just stick to polish. news flash, headlight restoration kits are polishing kits marked up on price.

 

[rcntype]

I'm seeing a few phrases thrown around with the equipment. Not too sure about them, can someone clear up the terminology?

Rotary polisher
DA (dual action)
random orbital
orbital polisher

Are some of these the same thing?

 

[Haloruler64]

I'm seeing a few phrases thrown around with the equipment. Not too sure about them, can someone clear up the terminology?

Rotary polisher
DA (dual action)
random orbital
orbital polisher

Are some of these the same thing?

Rotary is an old school polisher that spins and can burn through paint. Dual action both spins the disc AND rotates the disc, can't easily burn through paint, much safer. Most people use these.

Random orbital I really don't know the destinction.

 

[dev]

Rotary is an old school polisher that spins and can burn through paint. Dual action both spins the disc AND rotates the disc, can't easily burn through paint, much safer. Most people use these.

Random orbital I really don't know the destinction.

Random orbital is what you find in most retailers like Sears and auto parts stores. It usually has two handles on both sides and the pad on the bottom doesn't spin only oscillates.

I had one back in the day and they are junk. Good if you want spread wax around but no cutting action and the motors are not very powerful.
You are better off doing it by hand.

The rotary might be old school but there is still nothing to replace what it does or its benefits. There is a perpetuated myth that the newer DA polishers make the rotary polisher obsolete, but its the other way around. I would still say if you are not experience stick to a DA. In the past one of the big problems with rotary polishers is errors left behind from improper technique and the reason why inexperienced pros used a DA afterwards to get the fine webbing out.
As DA polishers were improving so were rotary polishers in three major areas.

1. Newer advancements in rotary technology like lower rpms without overheating the motor and direct gear drive for consistent torque output.
2. Advancements in pad technology that is far more forgiving so you don't burn paint which allows you more run time and no holograms even for the inexperienced.
3. Single compound/polish in one bottle which is a huge leap. Just one polish and pad does it all. There is no switching polish or pads, you will be able to do any car with excellent run time and no errors. You can just about correct for anything in one pass and you will not thin the paint excessivly.

The major advantage with advanced rotary polish is being able to break down the polish giving you variable polishing grades as you work. Its like having 50 different polishes all timed precisely into the working time so the end result is blemish free finish with optical clarity.

With other polishers you need to choose a grade of polish and pad for the kind of defect. It takes forever and can cost a small fortune to invest in so much stuff. What generally happens is if you go too fine with a single polish there might be some deeper scratches that don't get resolved.

 

[dev]

Not sure why there're so many different threads and posts on forums/social media/youtube about this. Polishing is literally the act of finely sanding oxidation (the stuff that makes your headlights yellow) off. So many different products, so many different (errant) methods, but props to you OP for getting fed up with all the BS out there. As a guy in the industry, this is how you restore headlights. polish. duh.

first polish, then clear bra. and you won't have to worry about it hazing again for another 10 years (or whatever the warranty is on the specific PPF you use). period. you'll be re-applying UV inhibitors over and over again, so just get it done correctly the first time. clear coats fade (thats why you're doing this in the first place), dull and are prone to a whole host of other spraying-related issues.

toothpaste? sure, use it. headlight restoration kit? sure, go ahead. wet-sanding? your choice. but all you're really doing is polishing anyway, so just stick to polish. news flash, headlight restoration kits are polishing kits marked up on price.

The main reason why I made this thread is precisely for the reason you stated. When I see endless threads for those kits and the high production youtube videos made by detailers to shill the product it makes me sad.

The internet is a great place of learning but its also a place where people over complicate the obvious to look smart for the ignorant. Its easy to be misled by so called "pros". People will then follow others blindly like a color by numbers rather than understanding the rational of what they are doing. In todays world of high celebrity youtube presenters and blogs there is often a difference between being knowledgeable and actual understanding.

 

[edspecR]

I'm seeing a few phrases thrown around with the equipment. Not too sure about them, can someone clear up the terminology?

Rotary polisher
DA (dual action)
random orbital
orbital polisher

Are some of these the same thing?

Rotary and orbital are the same, they just go in circles.
DA and random orbital are the same, they go in circles on 2 different axis, kinda like what you'd be doing hand-polishing. your hand moves in circles while your arm moves in a larger circle. hence Dual Action. Random orbital is another word for the same thing (your arm being the randomizer to your hand orbiting). Different nomenclatures because of different industries. Random orbital iirc is more for sanders/industrial types (i use a 6" Random Orbital sander as a DA, just a matter of changing out pads) while DA is for detailing/car care. marketing, you know how it is.

As for DA vs Rotary, they do not necessarily overlap. the point of the DA is so you do not build up heat, which makes it good for polishing and buffing. Rotaries work off of the heat in order to work paint around, which is why you end up needing to lubricate it and risk burning the paint. you would never be able to paint correct using a DA, the paint wouldn't move. Use the rotary quick enough with the specific pad and you can do everything a DA can, plus more.